Tracking a $20M Install: The Architect Shuts Down

You integrators out there are probably used to encountering these curveballs thrown at you from customers, builders, contractors, architects etc.
But working for a manufacturer, I don’t always get to hear these tails from the trenches and find them very interesting.  Adds a new level of respect for what you all are doing out there. Thanks for sharing Mark, looking forward to the next installment.

Wow, a positive comment.  We don’t get too much of that round these parts, thanks.
This series of articles was really about creating a space to talk about this and projects like it.  The problems I encounter are the same every other CI runs into on most jobs.  The issues get resolved but its nice to see how someone else handles these things and to hear from other dealers and what they might do.  For all the potential of the web we sometimes squander it on silliness and puffing up for the audience.

Yeah well it was either post here or join the battle over on the iPad threads. I’m not an iPad fan so better focus my attention on something that does interest me.

Mark,

I agree with the assessments of your situation.  What you are highlighting is something that, unfortunately, is pretty typical out in the field (just not quite as large a scale).  You’re having a positive attitude and keeping the vision moving forward despite the obstacles is commendable.

Much of the work we have been doing lately is coming in after things have been sold and designed a year ago that the integrator now has to make it work (and for the same budget).  There have been a ton of changes in the requirements, design, and available products.  Overcoming the immediate hurdles and having the final goal in mind is essential to success.  The best of luck!

I will throw my name into the fray as one to help evaluate where you are and where you need to go.  I am sure I will learn a lot along the way, too.

Regards,

  =D-

Derek R. Flickinger
Interactive Homes, Inc.

Gary Reber from Widescreen Review would be a great member of your jury. He’s intimately familiar with all aspects of CI and is personally in the middle of his own “dream home” construction project.

As Mr. Spock said (I believe) to Mr. Savak in The Wrath of Kahn, “Sauce for the Goose”. But seriously, this is where the most experienced CI professional shine. There is a lot more to this than just being a technology guy, a design firm or a client rep. And why a BOM and a shopping list are the worst way to pick an installation company and the products to be used.

Every project is a challenge and bigger projects are just bigger challenges.  The house will be built, systems will go in and the client will be happy in the end.  The only hard part is getting there.
Thanks for all the support, the tone has changed and based on all the email I get from this, there are some really great companies looking to lend a hand.

Joel,

I have personally run dozens projects of this size with my own company and know how hard it can be given the scale.  The CI we chose will have the skill set and background to bring this project to closure.  Every client and project is different but experience always seems to make a difference.  The biggest challenge is committing to a HD distribution system with so many changes coming in the near future.  Everything else is pretty much in the box as far as overall design (just waiting on whomever is chosen to put their touch on it).

Yep- my point, a seasoned CI professional will rise to this challenge and others which can pop up along the way.
Fixture substitutions, new loads, out of date DWGs, furniture sketches which somehow show up after the equipment is delivered and so on. I don’t look at custom as In the box, more as how you can plan to put the above items back into the box.
Perhaps that’s just a different perspective with the same outcome.

Mark,
It is fun to read this. It’s a bit like reading an autobiography. Seasoning aside, I think it takes a special passion for large scale projects and a great ability to project and visualize.
Regards,
Scott

Scott,

We’ve both seen our share of big projects like so many other integrators out there.  This has been a very interesting experiment in looking at our industry.  People who have read this aren’t looking at me as much as everyone who comments for good or bad.
If I was a homeowner this would raise more questions than answers about what I should do with my home.  There are so many great companies out there offering fantastic products for a good price who stand behind their systems, it can sometimes be hard to find them. 
I can’t say I’ve made it any easier but it isn’t over yet and we will just have to see how it ends.
Cheers,
Mark

Last night I was contacted by a local dealer who is concerned that I am unfairly putting blame on the architect.
The architect is very good at design and has created a fabulous home and property design.  The client is pushing him on all sides to “get it done” beyond what can maybe even be considered reasonable, it’s what clients do.
The problem is an architect is the leader on these jobs because it is his vision we are following and if he doesn’t take control or have a way to make things work it affects all the subcontractors.  We are being asked to perform at a certain level while being compromised in other areas.  His skills are evident in the design but more leadership is required or everyone will do what is best for their job at the expense of others on the project.  I have a meeting next week with the owner and will address these issues, not something I look forward to but it has to be brought up.
Tired old saying but it usually applies, speed, price or quality, pick two.

A large project like this requires a huge level of experience and a top notch support staff.
My experience tells me that a $500,000 A/V budget is a drop in the bucket and is in no way enough money to complete a project of this magnitude. My understanding is that an A/V contractor has not been hired yet. This should tell the principals that they have to come up with more money to attract a top notch A/V contractor capable of undertaking this project.

I have heard this a lot since we started this public project.  I just finished judging for the CEA Mark of Excellence awards and while there were some projects over a million most were UNDER $500,000 and still amazing systems in very large homes.  Throwing a number at a job without knowing the job shows a lack of understanding.  We can always spend more on a project, that’s easy with all the technology available.  To give a customer just what they want is a bigger challenge.

First we have to educate them on what’s available and then let them make choices.
I have had so many companies apply I haven’t even been able to respond to them all with more coming in everyday.  These are large well know groups who have worked on many projects of this size both local and out of state.  My favorites are the companies from England and Costa Rica, that travel might impact my budget.

I have been talking to local companies and plan on going through some homes next week to let the client make a final decision on products so we can choose a CI.

Comments like these could make consumers think this technology is out of reach and it isn’t at all.  So many great choices at so many price points to fit any budget and still have a great system.  We need to stop scaring people into spending more and instead offer them choices that fit them.  I hear the same two products over and over as if this is all there is at this level of house.  We only hurt ourselves and our industry by perpetuating these myths. 

Lots of great companies, offering lots of great choices that would fit any consumers home and budget, enough with the golden calves.

I was also a judge for the CEA Mark of Excellence awards and agree with Mark that there were some entries that exhibited outstanding accomplishments by industry members who did amazing jobs of meeting all of their clents’ desires, needs and expectations (and, did it all within budget).

A 28,000 sq.ft. house is no small project by any means.
Of course one can put a system in that is less expensive but in a $20,000,000 house I know there challenges to be addressed.
I have been in the business since 1984 and my experience tells me that I would not even think about a large project without using one of the top automation systems.
Every day I hear about companies going out of business. If I was building a $20,000,000 house I certainly would want to feel comfortable knowing the system I install will still be around in the years to come to support it.
These are hard times and Architects aren’t the only ones going out of business but at least you can still hire another Architect.
What happens if your control manufacturer goes out of business?
But what do I know…

Alan,

You say you would only use one of the top control systems, give me a list.  I think I am looking at three of the best but you let me know what you would offer as choices.  Too many companies only offer one thing wrapped in a different box. 

While times are hard and companies are going away there is still stability in the major players.  Just like a lot of CIs we will weather the storm and come out the other side. 

Again, scaring people with comments about an unstable businesses doesn’t help our industry look appealing to consumers.  Considering how bad it has been I think the CE industry has done well to not have more fallout, and no one gave us billions of dollars.

Mark,
Over the years I have installed Audio Access, Niles, Sonance, Russound, AMX and Crestron.
For the last 9-1/2 years I have been a Crestron Dealer.
I’m not trying to scare anyone but my trust has been with Crestron and their incredible support team.
My experience has been that a customer building even a $2,000,000 house would want a top of the line system and demands attention to detail.
Experience, time, detail and labor doesn’t come cheap.
When we design and install a large system I need to pay attention and give the customer a feeling of confidence that they are getting their money’s worth.
Every customer is different but at the high end of the spectrum I find that they usually want the best.

As a system design and installatoin company I have to agree with Mark. There is no way of knowing how much a project will cost until a meeting with the client is performed and a scope is developed. We have done projects of this size that have less money in them because the owner simply does not want it. While other projects we do dwarf there budget. Its all about providing the client what they really want.

I and my staff have been following this site with both amusement and sighs of “yet another project that will go through several integrators” 

Kevin Holm is absolutely correct, an accurate budget cant be determined until one goes through a design process with the client. 

However, it is apparent that the preliminary gear selection shows a lack of understanding of both today and tomorrows technology and the requirements unique to a house of this scale.  ... i.e. any good CI knows why using a ZV 250 is both a compromise now nor wont even work by the home’s completion date.  and the home theater speaker selection ? is the theater for 4 people ?? 

In a house where individual non AV items will be $500k it is short sighted to consider this budget unless the system integration and entertainment can be the one 2nd level item in the house. 

I see a lot of “ego” from both the host of this site as well as people commenting.

I hear claims but I would be very interested in seeing a portfolio of projects of similar scale this designer has supervised.

Like many who have commented here, we have all seen a number of projects where the designer is in over their head or trying to apply mid fi / small house oriented systems to large scale projects. 

I recently encountered two homes that attempted to use the new rush of technologies / brands designed for 3500 sq ft homes and apply them to 16k+ residences and then wondered why the systems kept crashing or plain didnt work.  Sadly this is becoming an all too common phenomena in our industry. 

it would be far smarter to take a commission and contact a firm like Tom Doherty’s or even better —-  an operation like Xeven Zorza’s to create an appropriate design.

The greatest long term benefit of this project online is watch how it develops as a future lesson to show to other home owners who try the same approach and help them avoid the inevitable and predictable outcome.  For that our industry should be eternally grateful to CEPRO.