Capitalizing on the Bose Brand

While I understand the reasons that CEPros avoid Bose, I feel that it is something that should be embraced.  Embracing regular consumer products is a good way to grow a business and have small jobs available all the time.  When I was the CI regional manager for the Good Guys, we started installing Bose systems as they were flying out the door, this provided a revenue stream that helped increase our monthly input.

Sure the sound quality might be lower than the normal high end installations, but if you really think about it, there are other products being used that are not much better.

In my opinion Bose is product to sell to get customers in the door.  Taking a look at their line up, it is a system that can be easily expanded with the use of the amps that have wired and/or wireless connection for a zone.  It is simple multi-room, add a remote, set it to the zone number and you are done.  Why not have that available to start a customer off on a multi-room system??

Start them off small and they will come back or tell their friends for bigger and better systems.  While the custom channel could live on the snobby high end systems alone in the past, those customer are a dying breed and we need to build the customer base.

Thanx for this article Julie, more CEPros need to understand the benefits of off the shelf solutions, especially ones that have recognition in the customers mind.

Julie, Julie, Julie… Marcia, Marcia, Marcia..

I was one of only (2) dealers in the US that sold Bose & Thiel under the same roof for over a decade. Why? Hank Eisengrein. His sales pitch as the Bose rep at the time was, “Dave, it only takes 2 minutes to sell a Bose system when someone asks for it, versus spending 1/2 hour trying to sell off of it because you don’t carry it.”

That one sentence began over a 20 year business and personal friend relationship. I still speak with Hank at least once a week, and IMO the only guy that can out sell me in this business. He is truly an industry icon… everyone knows Hank.

Now, you know I love you too Julie, but I have a question for you… Would this article have anything to do with all of the Bose advertising that is now on this website?

Granted, I don’t have a subscription to, “Builder,” magazine, but I also don’t have one for, “Field & Stream,” whereas I can learn to build a raft out of twigs and Band-Aids.

However, (to be fair and not let my preconceived notions get in the way), I just saw this months issue of, “Builder,” magazine. I can’t believe I didn’t know that, “Monier Lifetile,” (I’m glad they didn’t say, “Lifestyle,” because Amar would have been on the phones with his attorneys), is the, “Greenest roofing product on the planet.”

Of course builders would recognize Bose as number one in all 4 categories! What did you expect? Even a Bose system sounds better to anyone who must listen to the sound of cement trucks and nail guns all day long. However, I personally would rather listen to a Makita power drill than a Lifestyle system… At least the Makita can hit a frequency above 10khz and their not price fixed.

Your statement that, When a client perceives a product as high quality, they’re like to hear high quality,” is no different than when my dog hears her leash rattle, she thinks she has to take a crap.

Sorry Julie, no sale. Bose is overpriced, price fixed crap. If builders wanted a real treat and see what they’ve been missing… Let them try out a Sonos system to see what true value is. Is Sonos an Audiophile product? No. However, it’s more than reasonably priced, easy to install, integrates with practically any other product/brand on the market, and offers a ton more features.

Hope you don’t lose the advertising bucks…

Sonos doesn’t integrate all that well IMO. With speakers and as a source input, sure, but not when it comes to control.

Isaac,
The only thing I don’t like about the Sonos system is the profit margin. Regarding control, I have no idea what you’re talking about. It’s been flawless on my end in every existing system I’ve integrated it into in every price category. However, IMO my programmers are the best in the business.

Bose & B&O are the worst… Like myself, these 2 brands do not play well with others.

Isaac - I do agree that Sonos doesn’t integrate as well as Nuvo or Russound with control systems, but standalone Sonos blows any other standalone audio system away!  In fact, I don’t know what the other companies are thinking.  I used to sell Nuvo but no more.  Until the old school companies realize it’s all about the content and delivery channel which Sonos has nailed down, I’ll never look at them again.  Give me Pandora, a free controller via an iPhone app, and then we can talk.  I also wonder how one can argue that Sonos isn’t to be considered audiophile grade?  If you’re just using the ZP90 and relying on good amps to drive the speakers, then you’ll likely get much better performance with Sonos than Russound or Nuvo.

In the end, it’s what the customer wants right?  They freaking love Sonos cause it’s so simple.

Bose still sucks IMO!

Dave - I agree profit margin isn’t great but not too bad if you go direct.  I think one can make a lot of money with Sonos due to the potential for an increase in volume.  Plus, there’s still the money to be made on the amps and speakers to drive Sonos.  A Sonos system can actually cost signficantly more than a Russound or Nuvo system when you’re talking 6 or more zones.  The difference is the customer doesn’t feel like you just robbed them with 3+ days of labor.  A Sonos job can get done in 1 day.

@Ed Tsvik: When I’m speaking of, “Audiophile Grade,” brands such as Nuvo & Russound aren’t even in the ball park. I agree with your comments, but when I’m speaking true snob audiophile quality, I’m speaking about 2 channel systems that start at $50K without cables or phono cartridges.

@OhMyGod: I’m an independent Oppo re-seller and those margins are even slimmer than Sonos. However, both brands deliver incredible quality for ridiculously low retail pricing.

I agree with you 100% that it is important not to be short sighted by NOT selling or recommending a product because of its initial low profit margin. Even though I make well less than $100 selling an Oppo player, I still get to re-program the clients remote at the very least, and get my foot back in the door to see what else I can sell. Since the Oppo comes with a M&P Blu Ray video calibration disc, in most cases I get to perform an ISF calibration too.

Not only did I just turn a $50.00 profit into a $500.00 profit, I actually gave the client a product that blows the doors off everything out there!

BTW: If I haven’t mentioned it before, BOSE SUCKS and is a disgrace to this industry. Ever wonder why Bose has their own stores? Because no one else can keep a straight face selling that crap anymore at those extremely high FIXED prices. If it wasn’t for their incredible marketing techniques and owning their own stores, (which have 10’s of thousands of dollars invested in sound treatment panels in their demo rooms), they too would be, “Virtually Invisible” in this business.

However, the Bose Noise Cancellation headphones are a great product. Why were they invented? So Bose employees would not have to listen to the crappy systems they make.

I just love Bose threads… They are as much fun as McIntosh threads.

Yeah, 50k for a 2 channel system isn’t true snob audiophile gruality… it’s just stupid.

Guess you haven’t heard a pair of Wilson Watt Puppies…

@ Dave Stevens

I’m no fan of Bose products, but I don’t understand why you’re so upset by what you perceieve as “price fixing”. Bose (like many manufacturers) has a unilateral pricing policy that allows their dealers to make a decent profit on products, withotu the risk of someone using the product as a loss leader and hurting the value of the brand.

I suppose that you can argue against the notion of unilateral pricing policies…but they’re legal and widespread (within and outside of our industry), so it’s probably not fair to single Bose out.

It seems to me that the dealer has a lot to gain by carrying a line that has a unilateral pricing policy in place…I’d be interested to hear if others feel differently.

I’m with Adam here. So does Apple have it all wrong, too?

This has been debated at length with the MAP ban that went into effect in Maryland.

http://www.cepro.com/article/maryland_ban_on_minimum_pricing_takes_effect_oct_1/

How can anyone in our channel be AGAINST something like minimum advertised pricing?

Julie, I agree (I’m now bracing for the backlash).  As an integrator I feel like I’m supposed to agree with the “I hate Bose” mentality.  But then again it’s like a Lexus salesman saying Honda sucks.  There’s a market for both.  I think it’s our individual preference and a need we have as dealers to serve our own personal goals and challenges.  I never aspired to sell Bose when I started my business, just like I never aspired to carry a consumer audio product like Sonos (which is the best out there across the board).  What I finally realized was that I was selling many custom components and manufacturers to satisfy my own needs…not the customers. 

Most projects we take on require products that are more custom.  However, as we look back over the last couple of years there are MANY clients that could have been just as well served by a Bose Lifestyle system (and many lost clients) that wouldn’t have required any programming.  Sometimes, just because you can doesn’t mean you should. 

As far as unilateral pricing is concerned, I set out today to replace an Onkyo receiver for a customer that retails for $599.  MAP is supposed to be $499.  HHGregg has it for $375 on their website and then quoted me an even lower price as a dealer $30 less than my distributor.  Not that I should expect more from Onkyo, but at least Bose and Sonos have a consistent pricing strategy.

I am making a note of this: Wed., Dec. 30, 2009, 5:01 pm.

Someone agreed with me.

Hey guys, all very good & valid points. Again, I sold Bose for many years and as long as the client was happy with the sound and features, I could care less. Any system sold ONLY has to please the purchaser/listener with one caveat attached… One day someone is going to walk into that clients’ home and ask, “Who sold you this crap?”

My problem with Bose is that the product is way over priced, their sales tactics are very misleading, and their parts & construction are the lowest quality I’ve ever seen. Not to mention, once you purchase a Lifestyle system, I dare you to integrate it with something else, (B&O has also done this for years). The product line is designed to, “lock you in,” by using proprietary interconnects and speaker wire to their products only. Is Bose the only one guilty? No, but they don’t tell their customers that.

Next, Bose stores/demo rooms are tweaked to the balls with 10’s of thousands of dollars sound treatments, and their demo material, (CD’s & DVD’s), are specifically equalized for their systems only. Even when I enter a Bose demo room, the sound is almost impressive… it’s no wonder why people who don’t know any better scoop this stuff up.

When I did sell the product, every month I was shipped new Bose demo CD’s which played very short cuts of music. It made the product sing. However, if you played those CD’s on any other speaker system, you could hear how the recorded/equalized bass & treble levels were so extremely exaggerated & off the chart, you wouldn’t dare use it on any other system.

Is Bose the only one guilty of this practice? No. Most high-end show rooms are also sound treated, and experienced salespeople are well aware of which demo material will sound best on a specific brand. I also sold Apogee for many years and we had a mark on the floor where to place a seat for the listener. We used to call the brand, “Apologies,” because we had to apologize if you stood up, or moved more than 10 degrees off center, (just like watching a LCD TV), and out of the, “sweet spot.” Magneplanars also had the same issue, and we took the same care in setting those puppies up. Yet, these products were worth every dime and created magic.

However, we were honest enough to always point out to every client any speakers’ shortcomings, and made sure that the clients’ actual home/room would & could accommodate what the speakers required for the best results. Also, our sound rooms were never treated. They were simply sheet rocked walls with carpets. Any experienced high-end 2 channel salesperson will tell you how many times the client would ask, “It sounds great here, but what about when I get it home?” Frankly, we very infrequently ran into that problem because we did point out that our sound rooms had not been treated. For those who were still not convinced, we would let the client bring the product home overnight for their own demo purposes. (I seriously doubt that anyone does this any longer… I have not done it in over a decade)

Thus, my problem with Bose is how they demo and advertise their product. Especially their 3-2-1 system which sounds like crap no matter what you do. Bose’ promise of having a true surround sound experience with only 2 block cubes and a woofer is totally misleading. I can’t tell you the amount of homes we walk into and the client says, “I paid a ton of money for this and it sounds horrible. Do you think it’s defective?”

Regarding price fixing, Bose set the standard. Do I sell other products that are well known for NOT being discounted? Absolutely. But then again you can’t purchase a Lamborghini on line either. Not to mention, I can’t think of another manufacturers’ dealer agreement that specifically states that if you discount our product one penny, we’ll pull the line and sue you. 

To be fair, Bose was cutting edge technology 30 years ago. You also have to hand it to them for introducing Acoustimass sub sat systems that everyone else copied, (and wound up making a better mouse trap by using much higher quality internal components at the same price points… EX: ADS, Celestion, M&K, NHT, Pattern, etc. to name a few).

Yet, their deceptive marketing techniques cannot be overlooked, and any one who has visited their factory can tell you how cheap their internal parts are. Paper drivers, 1oz magnets, and 22 & 24 gage speaker wire do not and can not justify their asking non-negotiable price. Ever wonder why this is the only speaker company that does not provide frequency response specs in their literature? “No Highs, No Lows, We’re Bose.”

Let’s also not forget how litigious Bose Corporation is. Cedia was not allowed to use the term, “Lifestyle,” and Theil had to change their CS 2.2 speaker model to CS 2 2 as quick examples.
If they spent more money on internal components than they do for lawyers, maybe one day they can become a leader again.

Julie, I hope they continue to spend big bucks to be able to advertise on this site. It’s time they give back some money from what they have stolen from rubes.

Dave,

Sorry to contradict you, but not one commercially-available demo track featured on a Bose CD or DVD was in any way altered or equalized.  Even if those involved in the demo disc compilations had wanted to alter the source material, such alteration is forbidden by terms included in all standard licensing contracts.  These were straight, digital transfers from the source discs to the demo discs with no intermediate tampering.  There is no question, however, that the source material was chosen for inclusion on demo discs only if it sounded spectacular on Bose products, but what manufacturer would do otherwise?  Let me know the next time you’re in Best Buy and you see the HI-DEF flat screens being demonstrated with “I Love Lucy” clips.  Nope.  They use material specifically chosen to make the products shine.  Frankly I see nothing wrong with that, irrespective of whether or not the other issues you raise about Bose are correct. 

Mark