Who is using what? I own a small business that is starting to get some large jobs and I am looking for a faster way to create bids. I know of Dtools (too expensive at this point), BidMagic ( Heard good and bad), and QuoteWerks (Not impressive looking props) any and all guidance is appreciated.

The bottom line is you need to write a pros vs cons chart for your business.  That will help you determine the best choice.  When evaluating the same thing for The Tech Source, here is what I went through.

-  Initially, like you, I was not able to invest in project management software.  I licensed MS Office and Quickbooks and sent estimates and proposals that were built in Word.

-  Found that building these proposals was not going any faster from project to project.  Along with a list of other company and project management issues the pros and cons list along with a steady increase in revenue began to push the benefit of investing in a program on to the to do list.

-  Deciding on what software between SRS, D-Tools and Bid Magic became the next hurdle.  The longer the decision was postponed, the higher D-Tools rose on the list.  The others are good solutions, but I placed more value on the entire package D-Tools offers.  It was a matter of timing and budgeting for the expense.

I also took into consideration that it was going to require the investment of time to incorporate a new application.

Conclusion: We have purchased and are licensing D-Tools.  We are still in the phase of setting up the application while continuing to handle a growing work load.  A position we feel most fortunate to be in, even if it is frustrating not to have the time to devote to finishing the D-Tools setup.  We are able to utilize the program on our network for small jobs currently, and hope to generate our first large project proposal in the coming weeks.

Lastly, don’t loose site of your core business.  What you do needs to be directly connected with income.  When your company is generating enough revenue to sustain additional expenses and allows you the time to incorporate a new appliction then add the software.  Don’t compromise on the functionality in hopes that the software will just magically sell for you.  Figure 12 months ROI plus adding a different task to your list (hopefully eliminating the longer task of creating proposals from scratch).  Of coarse, one big project sold could cover the entire expense.

Happy estimating!

Morgan Harman
The Tech Source
Home Theaters and more… in Southern California
http://www.TheTechSource.net
Lic.# 849004

We use SRS. It takes a lot of time setting up products. The advanced proposal design it very flexible and incorporates graphics. It allows you to really see margins and easliy adjust on a case by case basis. Customers really like seeing pictures of each item and I think them makes them feel more comfortable about the amount of money they’re spending. It’s not as expensive as D-Tools, but it was still a lot of money. It’s worth it though…

Vsound - 28 January 2009 09:10 PM

Who is using what? I own a small business that is starting to get some large jobs and I am looking for a faster way to create bids. I know of Dtools (too expensive at this point), BidMagic ( Heard good and bad), and QuoteWerks (Not impressive looking props) any and all guidance is appreciated.

There is software that is cool looking designed to create a budget in your first client meeting, salez toolz.  To do truly good design you need to build systems that are repeatable and scalable.  Most compannies start from scratch with each job but the companies that are able to reuse their designs in multiple jobs make more money and deliver a tested product.  Any of design softwares will work but having a plan in how to build systems will make it much easier

Who all here includes drawings and schematics in their Proposals? Most of my jobs are under $100k and very rarely do I need to include those. Seems like every time I find a nice software program it about breaks me having to pay for all the license fees. Any other popular programs out there?

Rookie,

Even the programs that can do drawings have a scaled down version to only do bids so you could start at one level and work your way up.  Any good design engineering program is going to require quite a bit of time to setup, learn and create a database.  This is true whether you use SRS, Bid Magic, D-tools or QuickBooks for your quotes.  Salez Toolz is only to create a basic budget and sales so it doesn’t require a database but at some point you will still need to have a program to create a final proposal just not as many licenses saving a lot of money.  Too many companies take on a software hoping to be up and running right away only to find out it takes more time than they thought to use the software.  I train companies all over North America and well over half of those companies have bought one software or another and never used it.  Maybe a third of those have bought two or even three different programs onlys only to put them on the shelf.  Any of the programs will work you just have to go in with your eyes wide open and really understand your needs both in the short term and long term.  Look at how to increase sales first then how to improve the systems in your business over time by adding features that you need, one or two at a time.  A small company can’t afford to spend all their time setting up their software but can schedule so much time a week to begin an implementation. I hope this helps but it will probably only add to the confusion.  Let me know if I can answer any questions to help your more.

Cheers,

Mark

Revolution, I posted earlier and described what we went through in the estimating process over the years briefly.  If you are at a point where you can’t justify spending the time and money on a large back office application then it sounds like you should setup your own templates in a word processor and/or spread sheet.

Even when we did it that way I still preferred to have drawings for our jobs.  Any pre-wire job I would want a drawing to show drops and to keep track of progress.  Perhaps if you are only doing one room installations that is over-kill.  But documentation is still your friend.

Morgan Harman
The Tech Source
Home Theaters and more… in Southern California
http://www.TheTechSource.net
Lic.# 849004

Sir, there are a few options not mentoned here. It of course depends what, if any network you have setup to run your business. If you are using MS Outlook, and especially MS Small Business Server to run your company, then I would suggest checking out MS Dynamics CRM. It can easilly take care of all your Sales, Marketing and especially track your Customer Service and installation scheduling needs. In addition it supplies live metrics and scheduling that enable you to monitor the progress and weak points of your business… something D-Tools and SRS together do not accomplish.

If you are not using MS Small business Server, you can use an online (On-Demand) version. This is completely web based and you can run your business from any interface, iPhone, Blackberry, Laptop, anything but a pencil.  Here is a link for you to do some research, the three tabs on the lower part of the page guide you to the many flexibilities of the product. If you are interested in using it, but dont want to pay the outlying cash, you can sign up for a free trial, a full version that will help you further make your decisions. On top of all that, the On-premisis version plugs directly into MS Outlook making the learning curve to operate the program almost nil, so you can be up and running in a day or two. That saves tons of valuable small business time.

If you do find you are interested in the CRM solutions,etc and stil have a cash flow isue, please feel free to contact me via PM and I can discuss Microsoft financing optons with you that give you a wondow of up to 6 months before making any payments. This could allow you to completely establish your business, use the tools and make some real cash before applying it toward your investment. Thank Microsoft, not me. Im not trying to sel you anything, but will help you if you need it.

You can still decide wether you want to use D-Tools or AutoCAD or just Visio to create you technical douments on a later date. Since Visio Pro is also a Microsoft product, you can add that to your financing options. the idea is to get you up and running, successful and make your payments when you business is running a bit more comfortable level.

I have been in this industry for many years, and know the above mentioned products pretty well. Keep the ocus that what you are trying to do is properly bid, schedule and track your projects without loosing the details off the backside of your desk. Technical docuentation does NOT need to be wholy integrated in and all in one taking forever to setup proram like D-Toold or SRS, although they are very successful for those that want to outlay the cash and can afford the loss of production while going through the setup times, as the Tech Source guy has pointed out. I feel his pain for I went throught the endless data entry period. I use AutoCAD for my documentaion now for it integrates with all the architects and other pros on the job without any hassles. But there are many solutions for you to pick. At least you can investigate the Microsoft offering without any cost outlay, and they will provide you the financing if you need it. Cool.

Microsoft CRM solutions site:
http://crm.dynamics.com/solutions/default.aspx

One more thing,on technical documentation, from Visio, ACAD, nakinCAD or whatnot… The reason these documets are created are to allow the client another reason to hire you. Once you go away, their system they paid a lot of cash for, even $20K deserves connection documentaion for troubleshooting, upgrade capabilities, programming, etc. They are not for you to hook up, for you already probibly know that. Dont forget to charge for your documentation… thats what pays for your fancy software.

George
ITAVA, LLC
IT&AV;design Assicates

ITAVA - 25 March 2009 03:59 AM

One more thing,on technical documentation, from Visio, ACAD, nakinCAD or whatnot… The reason these documets are created are to allow the client another reason to hire you. Once you go away, their system they paid a lot of cash for, even $20K deserves connection documentaion for troubleshooting, upgrade capabilities, programming, etc. They are not for you to hook up, for you already probibly know that. Dont forget to charge for your documentation… thats what pays for your fancy software.

Feel free to check out our website to see what is possible with Visio with alot of time on your hands !
Leaving documentation with your clients is a smart thing to do. You may even have to use them yourself as the installer who put the project in may no longer work for your firm. Trying to figure out what happened after the fact can cost
almost as much as it would have to properly document the project in the first place. And, I have found that
if you leave the drawings in a nice binder, your client actually shows them off to their friends. Call it an unpaid
referral service, your own satisfied clients.

Xeven Zorza
ArchiTechKnowlogy
Design Group
Laguna Beach Ca
949.285.9787
.(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address)
http://www.ATKDG.com

Vsound - 28 January 2009 09:10 PM

Who is using what? I own a small business that is starting to get some large jobs and I am looking for a faster way to create bids. I know of Dtools (too expensive at this point), BidMagic ( Heard good and bad), and QuoteWerks (Not impressive looking props) any and all guidance is appreciated.

You may want to look into MS Accounting 2009. It does everything you need for proposals, sales orders, purchase orers, invoices etc, including designing your own templates with MS Word as well as managing your acount reciveable and payable. For drawing, there is always Visio. The ap cost about $200.

If I’m not wrong you can try it for free for 60 days. here is the link:
http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/accounting/FX100518171033.aspx

Goodluck.

Probably 90% of the dealers I talk to use QuickBooks, kind of the standard in the industry.  This means you will find lots of support for the program.  Starting out you can use estimates to create your detailed proposal and use microsoft word to dress it up to look more presentable but you don’t want to just hand off a “shopping list” for the competition to bid against your company.  Better to keep some information in your pocket and try to go low detail big picture until someone is paying you money.  When you finally do bring design inhouse most of these programs interface to QuickBooks so you are building towards the future and not having to completely start over when you do upgrade.
Check out Simply Reliable softeware too, great program and really nice group of people.  There are lots of options just don’t get too much on your plate at one time.  The accountting software is where you should start since every company needs goods financials to run their business.
Check out this link to a webinar from CE Pro http://www.cepro.com/webinars/details/handle_on_your_business_in_2009 ,To be fair the person giving the webinar is my partner and wife but the information is something every business owner should know.

Best Regards,

Mark Sipe

http://www.abacusprime.com

Hi guys (and girls),
What features are you looking for? How much do you want to pay? Do you want software, or webware? How many users will you have?
Our small company (12 employees) has tried many of the popular software suites, and they were either too generic, to complex, or too expensive. So we had our own built. We didn’t want something a full time engineer or designer with fourteen college degrees has to run, but we wanted something that could keep track of all the contacts, appointments, multiple calendars, projects, notes, and something we could generate a nice looking proposal with. Best of all- we had it built so it’s all web based and secure. Really nice when you remember something at home that needed added to a proposal. This is very simple as of yet. No Quickbooks or Outlook integration, no Visio, no budget forecasting, no accounting features- just the basics but it works. I’ve found most companies have Quickbooks or Peachtree for all the sensitive accounting anyway.
This is not something we are currently selling or licensing out, but are thinking of it. I’d like to find some people out there in my shoes that are willing to demo this and tell me what they think. 
So if anyone here is looking to try a simple web based schedule and proposals solution, shoot me an email and I’ll get you started.   
Josh Gorrell
.(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address)

Vsound - 28 January 2009 09:10 PM

Who is using what? I own a small business that is starting to get some large jobs and I am looking for a faster way to create bids. I know of Dtools (too expensive at this point), BidMagic ( Heard good and bad), and QuoteWerks (Not impressive looking props) any and all guidance is appreciated.

QuoteWerks can produce Quotes and Proposals that rival or surpass any quoting solution on the market. I would be more than happy to assist you in working with your layout.

I work for Aspire – the developers of QuoteWerks. Over the last several years we’ve gained a lot of traction in your industry as a more affordable solution. I have personally worked with a number of businesses in the AV space that have customized QuoteWerks for their business at a significant savings over some of our competition that you mentioned. We’ve been around since 1993 and have over 51,000 users in over 100 countries. We don’t perform all of the industry specific things that some of the industry specific products do such as wire run calculations. We do have a free API that enables you or someone else to add these as needed.

Our product starts at $199 one time fee (No $1000+ price tags and no monthly or annual fees). We pride ourselves on keeping our price down at an affordable level where you can immediately get a return on your investment. We can do this because we have tens of thousands of users. We also keep costs down because we choose reliable technologies that just work, so our support costs are low and you can always reach our support line.

Not only is QuoteWerks a stand-alone Quotation, Estimate, and Proposal generator, but we also have integrations to leading CRM and Accounting packages (QuickBooks, Peachtree, and more).

Something that sets us apart from the competition is how we are seamlessly integrated into your normal workflow. We are able to retrieve contact information from your CRM package (no double entry) and quickly generate a quote based on this potential customer’s details. We then write back relevant details to the CRM package with follow-up call information, a link to the document in QuoteWerks, and most importantly – the Opportunity information!

When the customer decides to move forward with the deal, we are able to easily transfer the details of the order to QuickBooks or Peachtree as an Estimate/Order/Invoice, so you do not need to recreate all of these details. If the items do not already exist in QuickBooks or Peachtree, we will create them for you. An issue that we have seen with users in your industry in particular is that you could potentially sell thousands of items, but in reality only sell a handful of them on a regular basis. With QuoteWerks, you do not need to clutter your accounting system with parts that you never sell.

We have a number of free videos on our website that walk you through our Accounting integrations as well as how to perform basic and advanced tasks in QuoteWerks.

If you have any questions about QuoteWerks or how we are different than our competition, please feel free to contact us at 407-248-1481 or .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address).

Another software tool that seems helpful is SalezToolz.  It is designed to help you sell during that first client meeting so you don’t take notes, leave, spend 2 hours working up an estimate and email it the next day.  With the proper setup, you can bring a laptop, walk them through the options and BAM - give them the price.  That reminds me… I need to get back to getting our sales and marketing info together.  Then I’ll be ready to get SalezToolz and set it up for our shop. 

http://www.saleztoolz.com

Where’s that to do list….